The Murder of Haley McHone Part 2

The 1999 murder of 13 year old Haley McHone in Lexington Kentucky by rail-riding serial killer Tommy Lynn Sells.  Part 2 discusses the identification of Sells and the interview of the suspect, told by lead Homicide Detective Chris Schoonover.

Show notes can be found HERE.

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Transcript

Marker 01

Speaker 1 0:00

If you have been looking for a realistic true crime experience , you just found it . Get ready for true crime with real detectives on the Murder .

Speaker 2 0:08

Police Podcast and every place that he went he wreaked havoc on at least one person's life . Yeah , he talked about a murder he committed in Ohio and I kind of stopped him . I said we will get back to that murder because now there's three that I know about and I know the ranger didn't bring up three and I told him we'd get back to that because I'm interested in that too . But we need to talk about Haley . And then we started about the details of Haley McCone's murder here in Lexington , kentucky .

Speaker 3 0:41

Warning the podcast you're about to listen to may contain graphic descriptions of violent assaults , murder and adult language . Listener discretion is advised . Welcome to the Murder Police Podcast , the Murder of Haley McCone , part 2 of 3 , with your hosts Wendy and David Lyons , chris Schoonover and Ray the DA Larson . When did your break come ? How long long after something presented itself ?

Speaker 2 1:24

January in 2000 . Wow yeah , happy New Year Happy .

Speaker 3 1:29

New Year . So what happened ? Tell us about this big break .

Speaker 2 1:32

Well , again , my luck , since I'm the lone man in the totem pole . I had to go in the office on New Year's Day it was your week again , wasn't it ? It was it was , and our sergeant , mark Barnard , received a call from Texas . It was the Rangers . He had previous encounters , again not by a cap , but his networking , I'm sure . The Texas Rangers called and said that they had arrested a suspect and he mentioned that he was in Kentucky and that there was a murder in Lexington , kentucky , that he would like to talk to us about .

Speaker 3 2:08

Wow , yeah , it was great . So he kind of told on himself .

Speaker 2 2:12

Yes , yes , I wouldn't say in a legal term that's telling on yourself . But you know he has something to get off his chest Right .

Speaker 3 2:21

So what do you do then ? Do you just start rubbing your palms together and say finally , Well , it's not that easy .

Speaker 2 2:26

So what happens is Sergeant Barnard came over to my desk , said hey , you're going to have to leave in four hours . We have a flight for you . They talked about who to send , and it can be you or Davey , or you and Davey . He said I'd like to just send you . It's New Year's Day , and here's what we're worried about . He doesn't like anybody . That's arrogant . He doesn't want anybody to come in dressed up in a suit . Good thing you didn't send my husband . I don't know you like that , but just to have a conversation with the man Sure just to sit down .

Speaker 2 2:58

And the ranger said that the suspect had already kicked one interviewer out of the room , so he wanted to be very clear that whoever we send just needs to have a conversation .

Speaker 1 3:08

Let's walk back , because you talked about that . They know this about him and they've been talking to him and he talked about wanting to talk about a murder in Lexington . Can you tell us what that conversation was , that the Rangers had with him , where that happened , even ?

Speaker 2 3:20

Sure what had happened . There had been a murder in Texas and the Rangers had been assigned that murder . And it was within 48 hours that he talked to the Rangers and got caught . The Rangers did a fantastic job in Texas . They put him in the back of the car from his arrest . They actually caught him on the way to an attorney's house with a weapon . They only made assumptions that he was going to kill that attorney , but they caught him in the car at that point . They only made assumptions that he was going to kill that attorney , but they caught him in the car . At that point they put him in the back of the Ranger car and was taking him to the Del Rio County Jail . At that point he said I suppose I know what this is for . He thought it was about Lexington when in fact the Rangers were charging him with murder in Texas .

Speaker 1 4:02

What was that story of that murder ? Do you have any details about the one they picked him up on ?

Speaker 2 4:06

I do , I do , and it's a sad story . There were two girls that were staying overnight with each other in a trailer park and the 13-year-old Katie Harris had Crystal Sayers over at her house overnight in their trailer . Crystal's parents had to go make a trip . Her father was looking for a job in another state , so Crystal was staying with Katie . During the middle of the night , tommy Lynn Sells climbed in the rear window of the trailer and covered Katie's mouth and sliced her throat and sexually assaulted her . Crystal Sayers was laying in the top bunk at the time this occurred and she woke up out of a dead sleep , saw Tommy Lynn Sells slice Katie's throat , so she was very quiet and closed her eyes and she said I don't think he can see me if I can't see him right , just like a young child would when they're afraid .

Speaker 2 5:10

Well , when Tommy Lynn Sells was done murdering Katie Harris , he noticed Krista Sells or , excuse me , krista Searles and went up to the top bunk , reached his hand up , covered her mouth and sliced her throat . She played dead because she was bleeding and he crawled back out the window as he was leaving . She waited and laid there as she was bleeding . She crawled out of the front of the trailer and was yelling for the rest of the family members and she thought they were all dead . She went a quarter mile . Of course , in Texas your neighbors are far apart . She went a quarter of a mile down to the next house to an older couple and knocked on the door . The older gentleman noticed that she was covered in blood and let her in and she couldn't even speak . She was so injured that he got her . She was motioning for a pencil and she wrote the family's last name and then she wrote dead as they were calling 9-1-1 for her . So this 10 year old girl being so brave wow was worried about the other family .

Speaker 2 6:19

It's pretty amazing wow she was rushed to the hospital , and then that's where the Rangers got involved in their investigation .

Speaker 3 6:27

And she survived that right .

Speaker 2 6:28

She did Next day , 24 hours later , she did a composite and identified Tommy Lynn Sells as the suspect that murdered Katie Harris . How did the Rangers catch Tommy ? Lynn Sells . Katie Harris's father , tommy lynn , sells at a car dealership and they had gotten an argument and they suspected that tommy had followed uh , mr harris home and saw that the young girls were there so his intention all along was to come back to the girls yes so how ironic that this happened with 13-year-old Haley and now we have another 13-year-old and a 10-year-old all female . Yes .

Speaker 3 7:11

So he makes this utterance in the back of this car . I guess , when these— . How did they catch him ?

Speaker 2 7:18

From the composite and then taking it to Mr Harris and Mr Harris said that looks just like this gentleman . So when they stopped him they had enough to arrest him on the weapon and going to this attorney's home because he was angry with the attorney . And later on , when we talk about time and land cells , you'll see that he has his own rules for society . So at that point they got him in the car and that's why he mentioned Lexington , not knowing that they had him in the car and that's why he mentioned Lexington , not knowing that they had him . On the murder and the ranger after meeting him he was great with Tommy Lynn Sells . He got him to talk about the murder in Texas and he confessed to that ranger about the murder of Katie Harris .

Speaker 1 7:59

When you talk about the ranger being great with Tommy , go into detail . What do you mean by that ? And is that something that's a go when you're with somebody ? How do you , how do you get great with a bad guy like that ?

Speaker 2 8:08

yeah , that's a great question . Thanks , david . Um , what happens is you have to build rapport in a short period of time , if , if you can believe that . So you know , this man has done the worst thing in society , so now you're going to have to befriend this person . So calling them by first name is a great start , and when he called us he even said Tommy , and we're going . Tommy , who he goes ? Oh , tommy Lincels . We just arrested him for a murder . Tommy wants to talk to somebody . Well , the ranger used his first name . You get him a cup of coffee , anything they want .

Speaker 2 8:41

If they smoke cigarettes , you get them a cigarette and you approach them about the issues that you want to talk to them about . You approach it like it's no big deal . You minimize their role in anything they've ever done and then you start to empathize with them . Hey , I understand you had an argument with a gentleman earlier , and so we have seen that there's been a disruption in his house . I'd like to talk to you about that . Can you tell me anything that you know ? And so you let them .

Speaker 2 9:11

What David and I and a bunch of the other homicide detectives used to say you keep them talking and you get a great lie is better than no one talking at all . So if you can start them talking and even lying to you no one talking at all so if you can start them talking and even lying to you , then you're off to a really good start . And here's a psychological thing that once you get a person with that personality of time and themselves and you'll know that personality right off they always want to tell you a story and how wonderful it is and the things that they have done is not their fault , and then you can start using what they tell you against them .

Speaker 3 9:52

Wow , so you get the call from this ranger . And were you just blown away ? Were you just ?

Speaker 2 9:55

thinking here we are some eight months later . Yes , I was a little excited but a little nervous too , because if you've ever been to Del Rio , it's in East Jesus , so it's way out there . So you land in San Antonio , but you have to drive almost through the tip of Mexico and then back up into a corner of Texas .

Speaker 3 10:11

What kind ?

Speaker 4 10:11

of preparation did you do once you got there talking to the Texas Rangers ?

Speaker 2 10:18

Well , prior to that , mark Barner , sergeant Barner and I talked . I went and bought a cooler once I landed there because I want his DNA right and I'm going to have to fly back with it . So I want to get the correct equipment to keep the things cold , get the suave and keep them secure . So a cooler is like a carry-on to me , so that's what I'm going to bring back with me if I can get his DNA . So at that point I call the ranger , rented the best car I could Flat , texas , fast convertible . No , I'm kidding , got to get there Right . So I called the ranger and I asked what kind of personality he had . I told the ranger what I was wearing , because when I flew I wore a button-up shirt , white shirt , a tie and just dockers . And he said well , you might want to change . Come in in just a polo shirt and some jeans , he said . And he already kicked one out . So here's why he kicked him out . And so he said just don't do that mistake . Why did he kick the other ?

Speaker 2 11:23

guy out . The other interviewer came in accusatory right off the beginning that he already had enough evidence to lock him up and that's not going to work with Tommy Lynn Sells . So from that point forward I just kind of went over my notes at a road stop rest of Haley McCone's case and details that I knew only he would know , and walked up to the jail and the sheriff let me in and the Texas Ranger introduced himself . He said I'm not going to go back there with you because he just told me about a murder and I don't want to involve my rapport with your rapport . We'll set you up in a supply closet . That's the only place they had for me to interview Tommy Lynn Sells and they used a VHS recorder .

Speaker 3 12:08

Wow . Well , I have to ask when you were on that plane and driving in your little fast car down to Del Rio , were you excited ? Were you nervous ? Were you just thinking oh my God , I could vomit , I'm so nervous , or were you just like I'm excited we finally got ?

Speaker 2 12:26

this part of the job believe it or not is not testifying in the court . My favorite part is interviewing , getting information and trying to get the admission or confession of suspects . I love doing that , so I was excited .

Speaker 3 12:43

You were in your element .

Speaker 2 12:44

Yes .

Speaker 3 12:44

So you walk into your little supply room , you , I guess , push aside your paper clips and binder clips . And was Tommy in there , or did they bring him to you ?

Speaker 2 12:53

They brought him to me . So I had changed in the car , put my jeans on and a polo shirt , didn't tuck it in . I asked all the questions Are you allowed to smoke in here ? And of course it's a supply room with paper towels , toilet paper , cleaner . And they look at me like , well , this guy's never going to get anything , he's slow , obviously . We're in the closet with cleaner , you're not going to . And they said obviously not .

Speaker 2 13:15

And I asked him how about coffee ? Where do I get coffee ? And does Tommy drink coffee ? And the sheriff confirmed it . So I said I want two cups of coffee . Just bring the cream and sugar , and we're going to leave it on the desk . So I already had it laying on his cup on the desk because I don't know what he wants in his coffee or if he even likes it . Now I say this nonchalantly but I realize now we've got a gentleman that has two murders that I know of , and I know he's got hot coffee and I know we're in a small room and I'm going to ask him to admit to me that he's done these terrible things . So I kind of positioned some paper towel boxes on the floor to where I can at least grab them and throw them up in case he throws the hot coffee . You're going to be wearing this hot coffee on your polo , right ?

Speaker 2 14:00

So I prepare the room for the interview and I remember the VHS . I was laughing because we have recording devices in Lexington . We have them in the interview room and they're high definition , but the VHS tape . I remember the camera being flipped around so I could see myself in doing the test . And then Tommy Lynn comes in and he's scruffy long , he's got like a mullet and he's in a jumpsuit . First thing he asked me for is a cigarette . First thing I give him is a cigarette in the closet because I had some in my pocket , because I know I'm gonna be interviewing a suspect .

Speaker 3 14:35

So so he sets it down . Your first appearance . I know you said he was having his mullet and in his jumpsuit . Would you have imagined from your first impression of tommy , are you thinking guy next door , are you thinking , oh , he's creepy as can be ?

Speaker 2 14:56

I'm thinking this man's been through the process before , so I have to be ready . Yeah , but I'm still excited . It's a very different feeling . You're excited , you're nervous and you're wondering what makes this guy tick . And the feeling of wanting to know what makes him tick and that you can help the community in the long run overweighs the nervousness and making mistakes when you talk about thinking it wasn't his first time in the process at a rodeo since you're in texas .

Speaker 1 15:24

What made you think that and what's the difference in that when you handle somebody that's been through the show before ?

Speaker 2 15:32

what happens is when you , when they approach you , you can it's difficult to say , you can tell by you . Look for tattoos . Regular tattoos are different than prison tattoos , right , there's more art behind your regular tattoo . Prison tattoos are black and white on the knuckles and on the neck , so I instantly saw that one was on around his neck or on his neck and then he came in like he wanted to control the situation , right , and that's a dead giveaway . And he's very comfortable in the flip-flops and jumpsuit . So I assume he's been through the process before .

Speaker 2 16:06

So how I'm going to approach this is I'm going to tell him , I'm going to give him two orders . First , I'm going to tell him to sit down and I'm not going to sit down because I want to be a little higher than him right from the meeting and I don't shake his hand right away . So those are the two things I don't do . Why do you not shake his hand ? Because I don't want him to be able to turn my hand and get the psychologically , if a person to me , they're going to take control of you by the way , they shake your hand , like if they turn their hand and they're on top to them , they know that they're going to be superior because you let them turn your hand . So I don't even want to go there . So I'm going to tell him to sit down . I'm going to ask him if he needs anything .

Speaker 2 16:46

So he walks in and you say , have a seat , and I tell him , ask him how he's doing and have a seat . And I tell him , ask him how he's doing . And I actually tell him well , you're in a situation .

Speaker 3 16:59

I'm sorry you're in that situation , so you're empathizing with him . Yeah , he might not have been expecting that .

Speaker 2 17:02

He doesn't expect it at all . So we proceed to just do the interview and of course you have these legal process . You have to do so now , him going through the process before you know , advising them of their Miranda rights . You've got to do it very carefully and let them think about it . But yet you want to get right into the conversation after you read it and you ask them if they're willing to talk to you and his personality . He wanted to know what I knew . So I knew it wouldn't be that difficult .

Speaker 2 17:34

After I read his Miranda rights and then looked at him and I said you want to talk about the situation . I'm here for him from Lexington . And you said you had something to say about Lexington and that's why I'm here . And his response I don't remember exactly , but I do remember him saying well , what do you do ? And I had to tell him I'm a homicide detective . He says , well , I guess you know why I asked for a detective from Lexington . That's what I remember , our banter back and forth . I said , yeah , but I've been asked to come to a lot of places and people just want sympathy or a visitor . A lot of people want visitors because they're alone in jail for a while . I said so . I need to know that I'm talking to the right person .

Speaker 3 18:18

So you turned it back around on him .

Speaker 2 18:20

Yes .

Speaker 3 18:21

And what does he say when you say are you the right person ?

Speaker 2 18:24

So he says well , I want to talk to you about a girl in Lexington . I said that's why I'm here . I'd like to talk to you too . So tell me a little bit about where you're from , because you don't want to go right into what they've done . They're not going to tell you . They may tell you but they won't be honest , right ? Because he knows in the long run this may go to court as well . So he's building his defense the same time he's telling you what he's done . Trust me , that happens a lot in the interview room .

Speaker 2 18:52

We talk about how he was raised , where he traveled , very interesting things on Tommy Lynn Sells and him traveling across country . We spent a lot of time about where the system failed him before we even talked about Haley's murder . He blames the judicial system in Washington State about not keeping him in when he asked for mental behavior assistance because he was arrested there and he said if it weren't for Washington State , these other things wouldn't have happened . And then he talks about how he was in jail in Lexington , kentucky , and they let him ride out the same night and he was working over at Transylvania University as a groundskeeper . It was pretty amazing the things that he did .

Speaker 2 19:37

He worked at a carnival in Ohio and every place that he went he wreaked havoc on at least one person's life . Yeah , he talked about a murder he committed in Ohio and I kind of stopped him . I said we will get back to that murder , because now there's three that I know about and I know the Ranger didn't bring up three and I told him we'd get back to that because I'm interested in that too . But we need to talk about Haley . And then we started about the details of Haley McCone's murder here in Lexington , kentucky .

Speaker 1 20:10

How did he get around ? When you talk about him getting around the country , he got around by train .

Speaker 2 20:15

Now it's very interesting because I asked him . I said how do you know which train is going in which direction ? And I know it's strange because I'm there about a homicide , but that you get to know a person and you learn for the next case . And he said well , I never learned which direction the trains were going . I would always jump on with somebody who knew they were going somewhere , so he would follow a homeless person onto that train and go to the next state .

Speaker 3 20:41

Wherever that may be .

Speaker 2 20:43

Wherever the train stopped and he felt warm enough , he stopped .

Speaker 3 20:47

So when you say let's talk about you , divert him back . Let's talk about this . Did you call her by name or did you say this girl ?

Speaker 2 20:57

At the beginning I didn't call her by name and I wanted it . It's another technique . Once you start talking about the murder , if you put a name to it his personality you have to really judge the personalities of who you're talking to . But his personality he could identify with a name and he had asked for her name when he had the encounter with Haley . So I wanted to see his and I didn't know that at first until he told me and I wanted to see his expression when I started using her name . And what was it ? He was fine with it . He was fine with calling her Haley .

Speaker 3 21:36

So do you then say well , tell me about this . Did he just open right up and the floodgates flowed and he just started from beginning and went to end ?

Speaker 2 21:43

Right . I talked to him . It took about six hours and then we took a break and then we talked two more hours . So we went through several cigarettes and probably two cups of coffee a piece . So when I talk about an interview , it's not something you , it's an hour and I'm out of there . Like I said , we talk about him first and we get to know each other and of course I , if you have to tell them I don't never tell them the truth about me , but if they ask , I always lie to them and tell them something interesting that I think they want to hear .

Speaker 2 22:15

And eventually we started talking about Haley and how he came to Lexington on a train and he had worked in Lexington for a little bit and he liked his alcohol . He admitted that he got arrested for DUI and when he got out that night he started walking to the University of Kentucky . And when it was getting light out he went to the park and he noticed a woman walking a dog and he said I was going to attack that woman that morning . But when he went up and asked her how her day was going , he said I was going to attack that woman that morning . But when he went up and asked her how her day was going . He said that dog was mean . He was not going to deal with that dog too . So he said he left and went to towards Transylvania University .

Speaker 2 22:58

And I said well , tell me how you went to Transylvania . Why did I ask that ? Because then I'll know if he's been in Lexington , kentucky . So he gave me the directions on how we walked to Transylvania University and actually talked about the steps , the several steps in front of the steeple building , and he said I sat there and met some homeless people and we went .

Speaker 2 23:18

He tried to describe it . He said I went to this place where they hand out jobs and then you can find a job for the day and when you come back you get paid . And I said where was that ? He said it's on a side street . When , something , when . So I knew he was telling me the truth . So he went to work that day . When he got off of work that afternoon he went back to that park because he knew the train was going by there . He was sitting on the steps or , excuse me , on the picnic table having a cigarette . He had bought some beer and he said this young girl walked up to him and asked him for a cigarette . And she sat there and smoked a cigarette for a minute and he said he thought a minute .

Speaker 3 23:59

He said I offered her beer .

Speaker 2 24:01

And she said , yeah , I'll take a beer . He said I knew she was young , so I said let's go out towards the woods there so you don't get in trouble for drinking a beer . And they both walked out there and he said I reached over to hug her and she started fighting back .

Speaker 3 24:19

And that's when he choked her and killed her . Did he know that she lived that close to where they were ?

Speaker 2 24:24

No , no , he asked her her name . That's how he knew . When he gave her the cigarette he asked you know they had small talk , haley how are ?

Speaker 2 24:32

you doing ? And he said she had on . He described her top . He said he took that off and left her shorts and then he covered her body up . He knew she was dead . So he covered her body up and took her bike over to the north side of town and sold that for more money and then hopped a train to Louisville , kentucky . Stayed there for a few days and then hopped a train to Texas .

Speaker 1 24:59

When he talked about strangling her , did he do that barehanded or did he use any instruments ?

Speaker 2 25:05

Yes , and on the interview , if it's on video , if you ever saw it . He even used the motion with his hands around her neck . Yes , he used his hands to strangle her . But , what was very important , he told me what brand he was drinking , and we found those bottles out there . And he told me about what brand cigarettes he was smoking , and we found , of course , we found a bottles out there . And he told me about what brand cigarettes he was smoking , and we found , of course , we found a lot of cigarettes . But so at that point I knew I eventually , at the end of the interview , I was going to ask him for a DNA swab .

Speaker 3 25:35

So he strangled her because she fought back .

Speaker 2 25:40

Was there any sexual assault , or was it just he was angry , so he strangled her he , he tried to , he , he called , he tried to make moves on her and she started fighting back so he killed her . He never admitted to sexually assault , sexual assaulting her and he never admitted that about katie harris . But they did a sexual assault kit on katie harris in texas and found out that she was sexually assaulted In Haley's situation her body was in such a state of decomposition , it was undetermined and you wouldn't be able to tell .

Speaker 1 26:18

Did he go into any detail when he was talking about strangling her ? Did he talk anything about what it was like or how she responded , or anything ?

Speaker 2 26:23

He did . And I asked him if she screamed or . He said all she did was grab his hands and try to fight back . He said when she went limp he knew that he had killed her and so he held her neck even longer just to make sure . He said I didn't want her to suffer . And he laid her down and covered her body and immediately left with her bike . Wow , her . And he laid her down and covered her body and immediately left with her bike wow . So the interesting part is I asked him also in the interview to describe the bike and he talked about the orange paint on the bike . So I knew exactly that he was the person we were looking for , because that was description of the bike we put on the posters yeah , because I remember I think correct , if I remember correctly , she had spray painted some different parts of it .

Speaker 1 27:08

It was very unique , which I think was frustrating us that we couldn't find that bike .

Speaker 2 27:12

Yeah , he sold that bike to a homeless person and I'm sure they rode off with it . Did the bike ever turn up ?

Speaker 3 27:17

No , never , it never turned up . No , chris , let me ask you .

Speaker 4 27:21

So he describes what he did to Haley and what he did after that .

Speaker 2 27:34

What else did you ? At what point does your interview end ? Well , it doesn't end with Haley , because I wanted to show him that I was interested in him . So I went back to you , told me about you were working for a circus in Ohio and that you had trouble in Ohio . So I asked him about that . He said there was a circus worker that didn't follow one of his rules and had started a problem with him , so he had used a hammer and killed him .

Speaker 1 27:59

Well , tell us about the rules , because you alluded to that earlier . Tell us , in the world of Tommy Lynn Sills , what rule did he violate , that he got hammered .

Speaker 2 28:06

Well , that's a great question . I asked him in the interview you keep talking about . If you break one of my rules , then you're done with me . I'm going to kill you or I'm going to hurt you real bad .

Speaker 2 28:18

And at that point I did get a little nervous in the room . He said well , for instance , do you believe me that I killed Haley ? And I said yeah , I believe you . He said that's a good thing , because if you don't believe me and I'm telling you the truth , you broke one of my rules . And in the same way , if anybody else broke any rule with children because I asked him I said OK , that's one of your rules .

Speaker 2 28:41

And I knew from talking to him that he had a girlfriend in Texas and she had children . I said so what are the rules for the children ? You have murdered two 13-year-old girls . There was a 10-year-old girl that you slit her throat . What are the rules ? And he turned to me and pointed at the video camera and he said turn that thing off . And at that point I said I apologize , let's talk about other things . And he was talking about other bodies and I said well , I'd like to get the ranger in here , because I don't know . You're describing places where you put these bodies , and I'm not familiar with that , but I'll be happy to stay in here with you while you talk to the ranger . So the ranger had been up all night . So we had waited till the next day and had brought the ranger back in and we had sat down and he told about more bodies and more murders that he had committed .

Speaker 3 29:29

So what was the children rule ?

Speaker 2 29:31

He never told me . When he told me to shut that thing off , I apologized and I wasn't going to go there again .

Speaker 1 29:36

Because the interview might have ended right , Absolutely Well , let me ask you this At least , or I could have ended it .

Speaker 1 29:43

Yeah , because one of the rules was probably wearing a tie , so it's a good thing you ditched that in the car . But let me ask you this , because you know we've sat in there before and , like you said , you get lied to . Nobody tells the truth . They tell a version of the truth . What did it feel like when he started talking about more than one like that ? What was going on in your mind ? Was it one of those things I or back home , because those are the things that just don't happen that often .

Speaker 2 30:05

And it's funny you said that that was the first thing that went through my mind . I can't wait to tell the other detectives that this guy even wants to talk about other murders and I'm going to be able to help them find these bodies , because I don't know how long it's been since he had murdered other people . And just his entire story was very interesting how he put blame on other people , like it's the other person's fault why he had to kill him . You know , the circus guy didn't follow his rules , so he had to go .

Speaker 2 30:31

He had to go Same with me . He said shut that thing off , I was going to follow his rules . You know , it's just very strange . What he found were the moral rules of society . One of Tommy Lynn's cells was on that we said some networks were carrying . He said the most interesting thing and I find it that we do this when we investigate homicides His phrase was see , you guys , many detectives , you guys make everything so difficult . When it's really simple , it's the simplest thing . Someone gets mad . You just have to know who they're mad at and then they get killed . And that was Tommy Lynn Sells . And he's right , because how often , david , have we been asked what do you think he was thinking ? Where would he go next ? And you can't with Tommy Lynn Sells and people like him . You can't put your brain in their thought pattern , because they don't think the same as every normal human being .

Speaker 1 31:32

Absolutely , absolutely .

Speaker 3 31:36

Hey , you know there's more to this story , so go find the next episode and listen .

Speaker 1 31:41

The Murder Police Podcast is hosted by Wendy and David Lyons and was created to honor the lives of crime victims , so their names are never forgotten . It is produced , recorded and edited by David Lyons , where you will find show notes , transcripts , information about our presenters and a link to the official Murder Police Podcast merch store , where you can purchase a huge variety of Murder Police Podcast swag . We are also on Facebook , instagram and YouTube , which is closed caption for those that are hearing impaired . Just search for the Murder Police Podcast and you will find us . If you have enjoyed this podcast , please subscribe for more and give us five stars and a written review . On Apple Podcasts or wherever you download your podcasts , make sure you set your player to automatically download new episodes so you get the new ones as soon as they drop , and please tell your friends .

Speaker 3 32:41

Lock it down , Judy .